To wing or not to wing

scooter · Post by **scooter** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 3:06 pm

Hi all, as you can see I am very new to the MX5 world, my first post will be in regards to a carbon fibre wing I have in my possession, can the MX5 handle the look. I realise it is much bigger than those normally found on a MX5. I am also planning on using the car on the track, what affect do you think it would have on the handling etc.
My reason for asking your opinion is that I really want to know what other people think both in looks and handling before I bolt the thing on or not!!
I look forward to your comments.
As I am so new I cannot post links to images so I have put 2 photos of it in my profile.

Post by **jif** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 4:48 pm

I say do it... it can't possibly be bigger than this one anyway

have a peep at miataforum.net ... search for the user "Blackbird" and the words "big ass aero wing"...

BTW - nice car... should be fun on the track !

poison · Post by **poison** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 6:12 pm

Welcome to the forum and MX5 world. There seem to be a lot of traditionalist MX5 owners about and they will have a spaz just at the thought of a big rear spoiler, but I like em, sit it on there and post a picture would be cool.

I'd like a dual fin one, kind of like the WRX Sti one's.

The more variations you do to your car the better or we'd all have the exact same thing.

poison · Post by **poison** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 6:18 pm

jif wrote:have a peep at miataforum.net ... search for the user "Blackbird" and the words "big ass aero wing"...

Are you sure

Miataforum.net seems to be an add page for porn and crap? Couldn't see an obvious way to search for users. And searching for Bluebird and bigg ass gives some interesting hits...

Post by **jif** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:16 pm

oops... make that http://forum.miata.net/vb/search.php .. !

seems they've rationalised their URLs and got themselves a cyber-squatter!

Bazza · Post by **Bazza** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:43 pm

I love the suitcase latches in Jiff's photo, presumably to hold the boot down.

Considering the top speed of the MX5, is this sort of drama needed, or just to impress the easily impressed.....??

scooter · Post by **scooter** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:02 pm

Bazza wrote:Considering the top speed of the MX5, is this sort of drama needed, or just to impress the easily impressed.....??

Not to impress but more to have an original ride. My concern is what kind of effect it may have at 160 + km/h down the straight at ruapuna. Not knowing heaps about aerodynamics I am worried if it would force the back down but lift the front and make the steering light. Anyone know??

scooter · Post by **scooter** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:11 pm

poison wrote: sit it on there and post a picture would be cool.

Cant post a picture till I have made a few more posts. 2 photos on my profile.
I reckon having a different look would be cool, just kind of worried about ruining the look of a nice car

Post by **zorruno** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:20 pm

jif wrote:seems they've rationalised their URLs and got themselves a cyber-squatter!

It has always been miataforum.com as far as I remember, which links straight to forum.miata.net

scooter wrote:I look forward to your comments.

I think each to their own in the MX5 world, it is fun not following the masses. Don't worry what others think, just go for it. There are lots of interesting MX5s around.

scooter wrote:As I am so new I cannot post links to images so I have put 2 photos of it in my profile.

I've recently lowered the limit on these - you only need a couple of posts now before you can post pics etc. The spam attempts seems to have died down.

Incidentally though, this thread has given me an idea for the new MX5 Gallery I'm working on... unusual MX5s

Post by **jif** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:33 pm

It'd only look right (to me) if you had the chunky tyres and rollbar to back it up. ie all or nothing. Tinted windows too, but thats just me... no doubt some would say a paper bag

That pic from before was the Tuckin'99 car ... a well regarded tuner in Japan. The suitcase latches (lol) are prob there to make up for removing the normal latch and opening arms.

I will say that standing on the anchors in the wet at 140km/h+ (Taupo - I've never done that on the street ...) was a bit nerve wracking with the back doing the macarena on me! A wing is meant to address that.

BTW ... scooter-wing:
http://www.mx5forum.co.nz/garage.php?mo ... age_id=163

scooter · Post by **scooter** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:41 pm

jif wrote:It'd only look right (to me) if you had the chunky tyres and rollbar to back it up. ie all or nothing. Tinted windows too, but thats just me...

Rollbar is hopefully going on within the next 4 weeks. Budget wont allow for big tyres just yet, but certainly is high up the list of things I want.

Growler · Post by **Growler** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:00 am

If you are looking at doing track work the wing could be too big...unless you plan not to run with too much "wing" (less angle). Having a well designed front spoiler and splitter (So there is minimal air going under the car) would negate any lift from the front. On a normal MX5 with no front spoiler at all doing 180kms the front gets very light...there is no steering feel at all.
Having so much "wing on the rear and nothing on the front will enduce understeer through a corner as well.
In saying this you don't want to have too much downforce on the car as that will affect your top speed.
With track work there is a lot of development on the car...which includes areodynamics (If the class you are running in allows it).
The one and only time I went to Christchurch there was a club day at Ruapuna. There was a white and yellow MX5 with a rotary turbo (RX7 with an RX4 diff and gearbox). I don't know the guy but maybe you could track him down and ask him for advice.
Other than that...go for it!

Growler.

Ian · Post by **Ian** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:39 pm

Hi Scooter...

I sprint my MX5 at Ruapuna.

A wing like you propose will do nothing for your lap times, in my opinion. There are no corners at Ruapuna where an MX5 will benefit from such a device.
There are a host of things you can do to improve your times, and most certainly race tyres should be the first (even second hand on standard rims will make a difference of several seconds per lap)

Good luck

Cheers, Ian

scooter · Post by **scooter** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:55 pm

Ian wrote:I sprint my MX5 at Ruapuna.

race tyres should be the first (even second hand on standard rims will make a difference of several seconds per lap)

Cheers Ian
I'm the guy that had the Silver Honda Torneo that was next to you at ruapuna a couple of weeks ago, I was so impressed with your car that I bought a mx5. I am starting to lean towards not putting the wing on for now, and I agree I would be better to get race tyres.
I have had a thought to buy another boot for the car (not right now but much later on) so I can put the wing on it, and run some tests, with the wing on and off, at least that way I can put my stock boot back on if it doesn't work.
Look forward to seeing you again.

Ian · Post by **Ian** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:08 pm

Hey, its a small world!

Great to hear there might be another MX5 at Ruapuna.......

Was out of town on business last weekend, so missed the pursuit sprint....were you able to enter your car?

Ian

scooter · Post by **scooter** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 7:50 am

Ian wrote:....were you able to enter your car?

Yes, they let me run it. Was an absolute handful on its little road tyres. I spun off at the hairpin, ran off at pothole and my biggest scare of the day was spinning off at the end of the straight. I was the slowest of those that finished, although 11 cars did not finish, so there is something to be said for reliability. It was far more fun than the tiptronic honda I ran 2 weeks ago.
I did learn that working on the handling of the car in the first instance will be far more beneficial than chasing more power.

MN · Post by MN » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:18 pm

If remember correctly, many years ago there was a photo in Top Down of an European MX5 one make racecar (or proposed car) which had a rear wing but it was mounted quite high to ensure undisturbed airstream.

poison · Post by **poison** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 5:02 pm

Another issue to consider of course is quality, as in rigidity and strength of the mounts. I remember following a Honda on the motorway when these big ass carbon fibre look alike spoilers first showed up here, all was well at about 80k-ish but when he hit a 100k this thing was wobbling around like the Tacoma Narrows bridge. Also it’s a good point about being mounted high enough, a couple of my drifting videos show spoilers ripping off (upwards) due to uplift. So there may not be any down force at all, aerodynamics is a pretty specialised field.

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scooter · Post by **scooter** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 8:02 pm

I have to say that I have received some really good comments and advice. For now the wing is going to stay off. I may buy another boot later on an mount it to that and run some tests on the track.
I have confirmation that my roll bar will be fitted on the car on March 12th. I will start to look at options for tyre choice, I will go for a road/track tyre as I need to be able to drive it to the track, anyone got any ideas?

Cheers

SLYDIT · Post by **SLYDIT** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 9:48 pm

the best place to ask about racing tyres for a club car is on the aussie forum..there are loads of guys that race MX5's over there...they even had there own race at the queensland round of the v8 super cars i think...

go here...
http://www.aus-cartalk.com/viewforum.php?f=19

MX4000 · Post by **MX4000** » Mon Feb 18, 2008 10:13 pm

The Toyo R888's are "cheap and cheery". I found they moved around a lot and tended to howl. I have run Dunlop Formula Rs - better general performance and lasted a lot longer but big $$$ (I got mine cheap - as always!). Yokohama have always been a favourite for the Lotus but they are getting expensive now.
Cheers

Psycho_Dad · Post by **Psycho_Dad** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 10:50 am

well i work as a plumber, i was just thinking that we use electrical manometers(devices that measure preassure)
one of its options is to add 2 pipes to the device, and it measures the pressure difference between tube A and tube B
in turn it would be perfect for measuring aerodynamic lift and the effects of wings and spoilers....
if only i had the direction and motivation(and the non wrecked back) of years ago

if your near tauranga, and want to read up on aerodynamics, i have about 250 pages on the crap

PEace
PSycho_Dad